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[[Communication Working Group]] meeting on Wednesday 2016-01-2027
=== Attendees ===
* Harry Wood
* Ilya Zverev
* Martijn van Exel
* Willie Marcel
* Hrvoje Bogner
=== Next Meeting ===
Wednesday 2016-0102-2703, [http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=CWG+Meeting&iso=20160127T2120160203T21 21:00 UTC]
=== IRC log ===
''20:52'' '''wille''': hello!<br>
<poem>
''20:53'' '''hbogner''': hi wille<br>
[23:33] <hbogner> hi
''20:58'' '''Zverik''': Hi everyone :)<br>
[23:49] <wille> hello
''20:59'' '''hbogner''': hi Zverik<br>
''20[00:59''02] '''<hbogner''':> andping hime harry-wood<br>when we start
[00:10] <wille> mvexel: Zverik: are you ready?
''20:59'' '''Zverik''': I'm expecting mvexel here also<br>
[00:14] <Zverik> hi everyone
''21:00'' '''harry-wood''': Hi!<br>
[00:14] <Zverik> sorry I'm a bit late :)
''21:00'' '''Zverik''': been reading Harry's texts from 2013, like this one https://hackpad.com/CWG-plan-early-2013-dXIuZVnmJxP<br>
''21[00:00''15] '''<Zverik'''> hbogner: harry-woodwille: evening :)<br>mvexel
[00:15] <Zverik> not many of us today
''21:00'' '''wille''': hi Zverik !<br>
[00:15] <Zverik> I wonder if communications@osmf.org is more active
''21:01'' '''harry-wood''': Yeah I was just digging out a more recent "report" form the end of 2014<br>
[00:16] <hbogner> there is communications@osmf.org ?
''21:01'' '''harry-wood''': which I posted just to the "management team"<br>
[00:16] <hbogner> i know only about @openstreetmap.org
''21:01'' '''harry-wood''': I'll stick it in a hackpad<br>
[00:16] <Zverik> well, that one then
''21:02'' '''harry-wood''': https://hackpad.com/CWG-report-to-MT-end-of-2014-KqgJ6StZtmY<br>
[00:17] <hbogner> you were talking about moving git osm-cwg to osmfoundation
''21:03'' '''hbogner''': ok, i should read those reports :D<br>
[00:18] <Zverik> yes, I have some items on the agenda
''21:03'' '''harry-wood''': Since then… a few things didn't happen, but some other things happened quite well<br>
[00:19] <Zverik> first, why don't we move all of WG's githubs to osmfoundation :)
''21:03'' '''harry-wood''': At the end of that report I said I would do a hugely pro-active thing… which I then didn't get round to at all :-( Still a good idea though<br>
[00:19] <Zverik> starting with cwg
''21:03'' '''harry-wood''': create a 'communicators' group and try to be more widely open with that<br>
[00:20] <wille> Zverik: it's a good idea
''21:04'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: well, I see your ideas for growing CWG is similar to mine: "be more casual" :)<br>
[00:20] <hbogner> is it possibel to migrate it all and keep al the issues and similar?
''21:04'' : ''mvexel [~mvexel@li643-206.members.linode.com] entered the room.''<br>
[00:21] <Zverik> maybe, I'm not sure. There will be one more issue of visibility: whether it's possible to include CWG to the team and not accidentally show them the board tracker
''21:04'' '''Zverik''': Hi mvexel :)<br>
[00:22] <wille> yes, hbogner, it's possible. github has a trasfer button in the settings of each repository
''21:04'' '''mvexel''': hey<br>
[00:22] <Zverik> I think this is more for the board and for mvexel, I've logged the task and will discuss it there
''21:05'' '''harry-wood''': But since then also… we had some more involvement from Mvxell for a while, and he suggested using github more<br>
[00:22] <Zverik> it's great to know you don't oppose this :)
''21:05'' '''harry-wood''': aha speak of the devil :-)<br>
[00:23] <Zverik> too bad Harry isn't here
''21:05'' '''mvexel''': yea<br>
[00:24] <hbogner> i answered you there with positive feedback
''21:05'' '''hbogner''': hi mvexel<br>
''21[00:05''24] '''<Zverik''':> Sookay then, let'sthe beginnext then.item Theis topichow iscan revitalizingI thejoin CWG... again<br>:) Is there a process?
[00:25] <hbogner> as i was told, you just have to ask :D
''21:05'' '''mvexel''': hi all<br>
[00:25] <Zverik> hbogner: whom?
''21:06'' '''Zverik''': I have been blogging about OSM news since 2011, but never thought of joining CWG. And most active bloggers, it seems, feel the same way<br>
[00:26] <Zverik> (I've been in EWG until now, and they are come-and-go group with no mailing lists or github accounts)
''21:06'' '''mvexel''': I haven't looked at the github repos for a little while, have they been useful?<br>
[00:27] <hbogner> a year, or so, ago i sent a mail to communication@openstreetmap.org and said i want to help :D then i was added as a recient at that mail and press@osm, and started helping
''21:07'' '''harry-wood''': yeah pretty useful. We've kept a few things ticking over there<br>
[00:28] <hbogner> i'm in local and communication WG's
''21:07'' '''Zverik''': oh, github. Around 20 open issues in three projects there, most are aoutdated and with no follow-up<br>
[00:28] <wille> harry added me to the list after I wrote a blog post
''21:07'' '''harry-wood''': ( https://github.com/osm-cwg )<br>
[00:28] <hbogner> i don't remember who adds new people to those mail aliases
''21:07'' '''Zverik''': e.g. what happened with the Urbanist? https://github.com/osm-cwg/tasks/issues/10<br>
[00:29] <hbogner> harry or someone else
''21:08'' '''Zverik''': do we have anybody in Netherlands? https://github.com/osm-cwg/tasks/issues/13<br>
[00:30] <hbogner> Zverik, as i figure you are already in cwg :D
''21:08'' '''harry-wood''': oh I did that!<br>
[00:30] <Zverik> ooookay, is press@osm.org advertised anywhere? I could not find it with google or on our wiki
''21:08'' '''harry-wood''': there's an urbanist postcast somewhere<br>
[00:30] <Zverik> is responding to media a job for CWG?
''21:08'' '''mvexel''': github requires some gardening from time to time<br>
[00:32] <Zverik> I think we need to add it to "Contact", "Press contacts" and "Press" pages, and also to http://www.openstreetmap.org/about
''21:08'' '''mvexel''': I can connect with someone in NL<br>
[00:32] <hbogner> i try to respond to communication@ and press@ mails when i get them, but there is some spam and some mails end up in spam folders
''21:08'' '''mvexel''': Floris, Henk<br>
[00:33] <hbogner> i don't think it is advertised, but we get them anyway :D
''21:08'' '''Zverik''': did somebody offer us free imagery and did we accept? https://github.com/osm-cwg/tasks/issues/20<br>
[00:33] <wille> https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Contact
''21:08'' '''Zverik''': mvexel: all these are from more than half a year ago<br>
[00:33] <Zverik> without a clear contact point, OSM is even today represented by Steve Coast, which is not too good
''21:09'' '''hbogner''': i mostly create github tasks when i notice something i'm not sure i can answer in the best way<br>
[00:33] <hbogner> oh look wille FOUND IT
''21:09'' '''harry-wood''': yeah. Well I think there's a few missed opportunities there, which we can just close<br>
[00:33] <hbogner> sorry caps
''21:10'' '''Zverik''': Is communications@ mailing group active?<br>
[00:33] <Zverik> wille: Thanks
''21:10'' '''mvexel''': github really works best when everyone monitors what's new through either RSS or email notifications<br>
[00:34] <wille> but it should be in OSM About page
''21:10'' '''mvexel''': github offers both<br>
[00:34] <Zverik> though I am not sure people can make a clear connection betweet OSM and OSMF :)
''21:10'' '''harry-wood''': yes we're using that mailing group<br>
[00:36] <Zverik> so I think one of us has to draft a page with a list of contacts: half for press and half for regular people
''21:10'' '''hbogner''': ok we should close all that are outdted and no longer available<br>
[00:36] <hbogner> we get all kind of questions in press@
''21:11'' '''harry-wood''': and presumably we're now all getting emails about github status changes (if we have notifications on)<br>
[00:37] <Zverik> hbogner: can you remember some funny ones? :)
''21:11'' '''hbogner''': i'll continue creating tasks as i se them in the mail, and close them when i see the answer<br>
[00:38] <hbogner> some people complain about map errors, some want their accounts deleted, some se osm as background maps with custom vector overlay overlay and complain about erros in vector data , ....
''21:11'' '''harry-wood''': yep. Thanks for your githubbing efforts hbogner<br>
[00:38] <hbogner> last one was about error in facebook maps showing switzerland in korea, it was here maps
''21:12'' '''harry-wood''': I think that's useful. But there's a few we just need to close and forget about now I suppose<br>
[00:39] <hbogner> that reminds me, i have to ask some friend in facebook what is their progress in testing osm maps
''21:12'' '''hbogner''': harry-wood, no problem, i do it when i get some free time<br>
[00:40] <Zverik> isn't facebook already using OSM?
''21:12'' '''hbogner''': i haven't made a changeset in months<br>
[00:40] <Zverik> at least a part of it
''21:13'' '''harry-wood''': One wider question with this is … does it need to be the same group (CWG) who deal with these kinds of email enquiries AND try to blog and tweet?<br>
[00:41] <wille_> sorry, my connection is bad
''21:13'' '''Zverik''': Now, to the topic. I see a number of blog posts / tweets / facebook entries / everything else is falling, despite the number of news in OSM constantly rising<br>
[00:41] <hbogner> Zverik, thats what i have to find out
''21:14'' '''wille''': I think we should decide what kind of subjects are important to post on OSMF Blog. I thought it was just to Board/OSMF actions/events. Because of this I haven't proposed more<br>
[00:41] <hbogner> they said their coworker was doing some testing last year
''21:15'' '''Zverik''': (that's why I stopped trying to publish everything to the shtosm)<br>
[00:41] <hbogner> don't know what was the result
''21:15'' '''Zverik''': But then, we now have WeeklyOSM in many languages<br>
[00:42] <hbogner> that also reminds me, do we have means to send someone to this conference: https://www.usenix.org/conference/srecon16/call-for-participation
''21:16'' '''Zverik''': So I don't think blogging news should be on CWG. On the other hand, blogging OSMF news (which nobody else can reasonably do) still is<br>
[00:43] <Zverik> hbogner: I guess you should ask OWG
''21:17'' '''Zverik''': And — sharing news. E.g. retweeting, linking on facebook etc.<br>
[00:43] <hbogner> tomh, firefishy sound like good candidates :d
''21:17'' '''hbogner''': Zverik, yes, before there was weekly on osmblog, and now there is weeklyosm, so we(at least I) figured osm blog is more for OSMF news<br>
[00:43] <Zverik> hbogner: too bad they all live in London :)
''21:17'' '''mvexel''': what is the scope of CWG - is blogging, tweeting, responding to press inquiries it?<br>
[00:43] <Zverik> right, another item was about grouptweet and the neccessity of knowing who tweets what
''21:18'' '''mvexel''': just curious<br>
[00:44] <Zverik> but without Harry I'm not sure we can come to any conclusion. wille_ said he doesn't need that, and me too
''21:18'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood mentioned attracting members to the groups is hard, mostly because nobody knows what it does, and thus thinks they would be tasked with everything and asap<br>
''21[00:18''44] '''<hbogner''':> moreyes, infoharry fromwas board/osmf/workingdoing gropupssome is welcomedtesting on osmthat blog<br>topic
[00:44] <Zverik> it's about trust, and if we don't trust CWG members, then why bother
''21:18'' '''harry-wood''': "communication" is too broad a term<br>
[00:47] <Zverik> what else...
''21:18'' '''mvexel''': + what is the target audience of the blog. I am assuming not the same as weekly OSM<br>
[00:48] <Zverik> do we want to invite active bloggers (i.e. WeeklyOSM authors) to hang out on CWG meetings?
''21:19'' '''mvexel''': the great wide world, folks who don't necessarily know a lot about OSM - do they want to hear about working groups<br>
[00:49] <hbogner> my opinion is that fresh blood can help, like you helped with reactivating us
''21:19'' '''Zverik''': from my notes: "Leave blogging to bloggers, serve as a hub and contact point."<br>
[00:50] <wille> yes, we should
''21:20'' '''mvexel''': hub and contact point - what does that mean?<br>
[00:51] <Zverik> there are drawbacks to that idea: too much people cannot be controlled, and we risk leaking stuff or giving access to blog/twitter to a wrong person
''21:20'' '''Zverik''': that is, the blog (blog.osm.org) is purely for OSMF news<br>
[00:53] <hbogner> cwg meeting are a start
''21:20'' '''harry-wood''': I'm impressed they've kept weeklyOSM going quite a while. These things often appear and last for a spurt of enthusiasm then die out<br>
[00:54] <hbogner> blog is more easy to control, everyone has his/hers own login
''21:20'' '''mvexel''': yea that makes sense<br>
[00:54] <hbogner> twitter is one password, and i get harrys fear of giving everyone the pass
''21:20'' '''Zverik''': but — it should link to every other news source on osm<br>
[00:55] <Zverik> I guess we should investigate that mediawiki plugin
''21:20'' '''Zverik''': so people coming to the blog could easily find other sources, even in their local language<br>
[00:55] <Zverik> and if that doesn't work, hire somebody for a month to write us the grouptweet replacement :)
''21:21'' '''Zverik''': currently it is nearly impossible<br>
[00:55] <hbogner> but blog, facebook, google+, redit, linkedin, ... are better to give more people acces
''21:21'' '''hbogner''': Zverik, that is the problem, local teams, chapters, gropups, pages, ...<br>
[00:57] <hbogner> there is one guy active on google+ osm group, we could invite him here to se if he wants to help :D
''21:22'' '''Zverik''': hbogner: if only there were many of these<br>
[00:58] <Zverik> hbogner: is that an official group?
''21:22'' '''hbogner''': http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/List_of_OSM_centric_Facebook_accounts http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/List_of_OSM_centric_Twitter_accounts http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Google%2B ...<br>
[00:58] <hbogner> Zverik, this one is official, and he posts there often
''21:22'' '''Zverik''': the thing is, wiki doesn't solve communication and discovery issues<br>
[00:58] <hbogner> Christian Ledermann
''21:22'' '''mvexel''': I don't think we can keep up with that<br>
[00:59] <hbogner> https://plus.google.com/communities/118411499520305090955
''21:22'' '''mvexel''': nor should we want to<br>
[01:00] <Zverik> then he definitely should be on CWG
''21:23'' '''Zverik''': two minutes ago I didn't know there are lists of twitter accounts in the wiki, for example<br>
[01:00] <Zverik> hbogner: are you on G+? Can you invite him here next Wednesday?
''21:23'' '''Zverik''': and I'm reading it since 2011!<br>
[01:00] <hbogner> last time we were talking about blog beeing more official and more formal, but we have so many social channels, not just twitter, and we should manage them all
''21:23'' '''harry-wood''': it's a good list<br>
[01:01] <hbogner> Zverik, yes i am, and if all here agree ai will invite him
''21:23'' '''hbogner''': i said it last year, we shouls set up guidelines for social network usage of OpenStreetMap name<br>
[01:01] <Zverik> thanks
''21:23'' '''mvexel''': hbogner: how would we enforce<br>
[01:02] <hbogner> i was reposting blog posts to g+, harry was reposting them to faceboook, and ii guess harry was tweeting them too
''21:24'' '''hbogner''': there are some countries that have 3 facebook osm pages<br>
[01:02] <Zverik> so that's it for today, I guess. I'll post the log to osmfoundation.org later, and mail the cwg to count me in
''21:24'' '''hbogner''': mvexel, guidelines<br>
[01:02] <hbogner> so couls we agree that any post on blog should be spread to all social networks
''21:24'' '''mvexel''': I don't think there is too much we can do about it<br>
[01:03] <wille> ok. I have some sugestions of people to join the cwg. I'll post about them later by mail
''21:24'' '''mvexel''': these things have a tendency to converge anyway<br>
''21[01:24''04] '''<hbogner''':> notok, enforcinguntil rightnext now,week justtalk setto upyou guidelnes<br>via mail and github
[01:04] <Zverik> hbogner: yes, cwg posts are very important and should be spread as wide as possible. But there are a lot of other interesting posts that should be advertised more :)
''21:24'' '''harry-wood''': We should add a 'maintainer' column on there I think http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/List_of_OSM_centric_Twitter_accounts<br>
[01:05] <Zverik> see you next week, and thanks for coming!
''21:24'' '''mvexel''': that would help<br>
''21[01:25''05] '''<hbogner''':> thereZverik, areyes, also some pages/groupsand that havewe thecan namedo "OpenStreetMap"on nothingsocial else<br>media
[01:05] <wille> see you
''21:25'' '''hbogner''': just OpenStreetMap and if you dob't know you can think it's official OSM page/group, etc ..<br>
[01:05] <hbogner> not everything can go on blog
''21:26'' '''harry-wood''': some of them could be stamped on by mentioning the OpenStreetMap trademark and saying "you can't call it that". We do actually do that already for iPhone and Android apps on the appstores<br>
[01:05] <hbogner> ok, bye
''21:26'' '''Zverik''': there are two OpenStreetMap groups in Facebook, both with thousands of followers, for example<br>
</poem>
''21:27'' '''Zverik''': I'm pretty sure there is a process to merge these<br>
''21:27'' '''mvexel''': I would love for the diaries to be better<br>
''21:27'' '''mvexel''': there is so much great community content there<br>
''21:27'' '''hbogner''': Zverik, there are two on google plus also, but g+ doesn't merge<br>
''21:27'' '''mvexel''': but: spam, no search, no language filter<br>
''21:27'' '''Zverik''': mvexel: there is a language filter: http://www.openstreetmap.org/diary/en<br>
''21:28'' '''hbogner''': as harry-wood said mentioning osm trademark for some of those<br>
''21:28'' '''Zverik''': but spam is a major problem, making reading the rss feed a pain<br>
''21:28'' '''mvexel''': and RSS is cool but it's for geeks<br>
''21:28'' '''mvexel''': I use it, you use it, but the rest of the internet doesn't<br>
''21:29'' '''mvexel''': I didn't even know about the diary language filter - probably a UX problem<br>
''21:29'' '''mvexel''': anyway didn't mean to derail the discussion<br>
''21:30'' '''mvexel''': just looking for some low hanging fruit to expose the vibrance of the community more directly on OSM.org<br>
''21:30'' '''Zverik''': mvexel: where do non-technical people usually get news?<br>
''21:30'' '''harry-wood''': So… language filter. That'd be a reasonable thing to suggest to developers I suppose https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website/issues<br>
''21:31'' '''Zverik''': the first thing to do with the diaries should be subscriptions to comments<br>
''21:31'' '''harry-wood''': oh.. you're saying there *is* a filter? :-)<br>
''21:31'' '''mvexel''': and I would really like an upvote / downvote system so spam would be weeded out by the community<br>
''21:31'' '''wille''': mvexel: it would be cool to have some "Like" button and a counter of views on blog posts so we could classify it by relevance<br>
''21:31'' '''Zverik''': because currently it is very hard to use diaries for discussions<br>
''21:31'' '''mvexel''': wille: exactly<br>
''21:31'' '''hbogner''': regarding social guidelines, something from 6 months ago : http://pastebin.com/BEcQrwsD<br>
''21:32'' '''mvexel''': Zverik: that is a good one too<br>
''21:33'' '''Zverik''': the problem with diaries is that we need a programmer with a lot of free time to improve them :)<br>
''21:33'' '''mvexel''': or a code sprint<br>
''21:33'' '''hbogner''': and that is not going to happen soon<br>
''21:33'' '''Zverik''': we all live in different countries, so that would be a challenge :)<br>
''21:33'' '''mvexel''': I already have two ideas for code sprints: 1) group feature 2) diaries<br>
''21:34'' '''Zverik''': let's talk about @OpenStreetMap twitter<br>
''21:34'' '''wille''': mvexel: +1 to sprints!<br>
''21:34'' '''harry-wood''': Another problem is that TomH gets super grumpy (like more grumpy than normal) whenever anyone mentions the spam problem :-) Don't know why really. We need him to explain what his proposed solution is that .<br>
''21:34'' '''mvexel''': because he's probably the only person who has access to delete it<br>
''21:34'' '''mvexel''': that would make me grumpy<br>
''21:35'' '''mvexel''': QGIS, Wikipedia, Leaflet, Openlayers all do code sprints. We have hack weekends but it's not quite the same<br>
''21:35'' '''Zverik''': the twitter is mostly empty nowadays. I see an attempt to tweet news, but I don't think that's sustainable<br>
''21:35'' '''Zverik''': mvexel: what's the difference?<br>
''21:35'' '''mvexel''': it's more 'bring your own problem / idea'<br>
''21:36'' '''mvexel''': (hack weeekend)<br>
''21:36'' '''hbogner''': mvexel, i meant programmer with a lot of free time is not going to nappen, not the code sprint<br>
''21:36'' '''mvexel''': in a code sprint, everybody works towards solving the same problem: a new release, a new feature. We had one for API 0.6<br>
''21:36'' '''hbogner''': :D<br>
''21:37'' '''Zverik''': how do you feel about using @openstreetmap to retweet everything osm-related, so it's like news, but more social?<br>
''21:37'' '''mvexel''': anyway derailing the discussion again. I will stew on this a bit. I am sure there are a few companies willing to sponsor something like that<br>
''21:37'' '''mvexel''': shuts up and listens<br>
''21:38'' '''harry-wood''': Zverik I'd like to do more retweeting. Grouptweet doesn't support proper native retweets though<br>
''21:38'' '''harry-wood''': I can only do "RT @bob xxx"<br>
''21:38'' '''Zverik''': mvexel: do you have any links to articles on organizing code sprints? Because it doesn't see like a working idea. You would spend a day just explaining osm infrastructure to programmers<br>
''21:38'' '''wille''': Zverik: On the last months I have scheduled twitter posts once a day from monday to friday to OpenStreetMap Brazil account. It increased a lot the number of followers<br>
''21:38'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: what is grouptweet?<br>
''21:39'' '''mvexel''': some example twitter accounts: https://twitter.com/qgis https://twitter.com/LeafletJS https://twitter.com/Wikipedia https://twitter.com/osgeo<br>
''21:39'' '''hbogner''': as I recall there was a problem finding out who posted a gropuptweet, or something like that<br>
''21:40'' '''harry-wood''': grouptweet is how we allow a few people to tweet from @OpenStreetMap without all knowing the password<br>
''21:40'' '''harry-wood''': I alway tweet via grouptweet<br>
''21:40'' '''mvexel''': Zverik: I think if the topic is well contained a group of good devs would not need to know too much context.<br>
''21:40'' '''harry-wood''': it also allows us to see *who* tweet what messages<br>
''21:41'' '''harry-wood''': works quite well except… no native retweets<br>
''21:41'' '''harry-wood''': also we pay for it<br>
''21:41'' '''hbogner''': ahaa, so it works<br>
''21:43'' '''hbogner''': we should define what is cwg main objective/taks/job<br>
''21:43'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: did you contact grouptweet on retweets issue?<br>
''21:43'' '''harry-wood''': I didn't<br>
''21:44'' '''harry-wood''': maybe I should, it's true<br>
''21:44'' '''hbogner''': there are only few of us and so much to do, that sometimes i feel like not doing it :D<br>
''21:45'' '''mvexel''': https://twitter.com/mvexel/status/689926522409385984<br>
''21:45'' '''harry-wood''': on spam, TomH shares his design thoughts here: https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website/issues/841#issuecomment-63868978 It's a website coding issue to be tackled.<br>
''21:45'' '''harry-wood''': Not sure if CWG needs to be involved.<br>
''21:46'' '''mvexel''': no not directly<br>
''21:46'' '''Zverik''': from what I gatheres, the cwg should be for: 1) publishing osmf news; 2) the main press contact; 3) making other osm news/blogs discoverable; 4) a meeting point for active local communicators to share ideas; 5) encouraging anything written, e.g. documentation and leaflets<br>
''21:46'' '''mvexel''': mugs<br>
''21:47'' '''harry-wood''': It's a working group about "communication" which is very broad. I wrote a list of communication aspects here: https://hackpad.com/CWG-plan-early-2013-dXIuZVnmJxP#:h=Areas-of-communication:<br>
''21:48'' '''harry-wood''': which is too much for a small group of people to do<br>
''21:49'' '''harry-wood''': hence we're just keeping the blogs and tweets ticking over and replying to some press enquiries :-)<br>
''21:49'' '''Zverik''': yes, that's why my list requires of cwg members very little, and that's what I propose :)<br>
''21:49'' '''harry-wood''': your list?<br>
''21:50'' '''hbogner''': few lines up harry-wood<br>
''21:50'' '''mvexel''': perhaps we can ask other WGs what we can do for them?<br>
''21:50'' '''hbogner''': 5 point list<br>
''21:51'' '''hbogner''': mvexel, communication with other WGs is good idea<br>
''21:51'' '''wille''': mvexel: maybe it would be better if each of us subscribe to another WG list, so we should see what's going on and proposing posts<br>
''21:51'' '''Zverik''': but other WGs don't seem eager to publish anything :)<br>
''21:52'' '''Zverik''': to the point the OWG even made their own twitter account<br>
''21:53'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: how many people post to @OpenStreetMap? Is it just you and Steve?<br>
''21:53'' '''harry-wood''': Well I think they decided that'd be a good idea because otherwise they are breaking the silence on the @OpenStreetMap account to announce some bad news stories (downtime etc)<br>
''21:54'' '''harry-wood''': yes. just me really<br>
''21:54'' '''Zverik''': how do you feel about letting 10-20 people on the group? :)<br>
''21:54'' '''harry-wood''': I'd rather not give 10-20 access suddenly all at once.<br>
''21:54'' '''harry-wood''': but also who are these 10-20 people? where are they hiding<br>
''21:55'' '''hbogner''': Zverik, get them to joun cwg :D<br>
''21:55'' '''hbogner''': *join<br>
''21:55'' '''harry-wood''': I've tried to get people to suggest tweets http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Suggested_tweets<br>
''21:55'' '''Zverik''': WeeklyOSM would retweet their announcements, SotM WG would write things, people who read a lot of osm-related twitter feeds would retweet everything 10 times a day<br>
''21:55'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: twitter doesn't work like that (re: suggested tweets) :)<br>
''21:56'' '''Zverik''': it's "write/rt and forget", not "plan and schedule and have people double-check"<br>
''21:56'' '''harry-wood''': The other idea I had was give loads of people permission to schedule tweets which would go out after a period of time, if nobody had corrections/overrides<br>
''21:57'' '''mvexel''': harry-wood: does grouptweet support that dynamic<br>
''21:57'' '''harry-wood''': nope<br>
''21:57'' '''harry-wood''': that would be using some hitherto non-existent tweeting system :-)<br>
''21:57'' '''mvexel''': perhaps it's overly democratic :)<br>
''21:58'' '''mvexel''': you could set up something with a google spreadsheed and IFTTT I am sure :D<br>
''21:58'' '''harry-wood''': I know twitter doen't *really* work like that. people prefer to be a bit more dynamic than editing a wiki page<br>
''21:58'' '''harry-wood''': but I hadn't predicted what a *total* failure that approach would be<br>
''21:58'' '''harry-wood''': In the time since I set up that wiki page we've had… zero suggested tweets<br>
''21:58'' '''harry-wood''': thanks for that OpenStreetMap community :-)<br>
''21:58'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: can I suggest myself and some more active tweeters (mine is @shtosm, but it's mostly in Russian) for @OpenStreetMap, so we could dramatically change its... forgot he word... how it feels and operates and interacts with others?<br>
''21:59'' '''wille''': harry-wood: have you used https://tweetdeck.twitter.com/ ? https://tweetdeck.twitter.com/<br>
''21:59'' '''Zverik''': with no cross-checking of wording, no scheduling, no suggestions<br>
''21:59'' '''harry-wood''': wille: yes. And it has a nice 'teams' feature<br>
''21:59'' '''harry-wood''': which *does* support native retweeting<br>
''21:59'' '''harry-wood''': and it's free<br>
''22:00'' '''harry-wood''': BUT…. <br>
''22:00'' '''harry-wood''': no feature to see who sent what<br>
''22:00'' '''harry-wood''': we tried it: https://github.com/osm-cwg/tasks/issues/11<br>
''22:00'' '''harry-wood''': so that's annoying!<br>
''22:01'' '''hbogner''': ahaa, that was tweetdeck<br>
''22:02'' '''harry-wood''': Crazy though this is… I have actually almost managed to re-implement grouptweet! : http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Harry_Wood/hack_ideas#Group_tweeting_tool<br>
''22:02'' '''mvexel''': sorry folks need to jump on another call<br>
''22:02'' '''harry-wood''': Bit more work on that, and we could be adding some funky scheduling and native retweeting features as we need them<br>
''22:03'' '''harry-wood''': The "code it yourself" solution<br>
''22:05'' '''wille''': harry-wood: good!<br>
''22:06'' '''hbogner''': i get up for work in 6 hours so i'll be leaving you soon, but i hope we'll do this again soon, and short witten summary from tonight would be good idea<br>
''22:06'' '''Zverik''': so I've just did a quick research, and there are two alternatives to GroupTweet: SproutSocial and MediaFunnel.<br>
''22:06'' '''Zverik''': okay, let's wrap this up, but first — is the next Wednesday, the same time, good for you?<br>
''22:07'' '''harry-wood''': Zverik: One bit of perspective to add here, I was on CWG throughout the license change years. This was *stressful*. A lot of attention on how OSMF was communicating the license change. At that stage there was no way in hell we could let 10-20 people manage the twitter account. We had to be so careful about what we said and how we said it. It needed some very *trusted* individuals being the voice of the foundation.<br>
''22:07'' '''wille''': Zverik: yes<br>
''22:07'' '''harry-wood''': These days there's less of that tension, so it feels like throwing open the channels to more contribution is what we need to do. But there's still issues we need to "treat carefully" around<br>
''22:07'' '''harry-wood''': "tread carefully" I mean<br>
''22:08'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: there is a trend in russian social media now: websites publish official news and are serious and all that, and social media accounts are much more relaxed, though often making mistakes<br>
''22:08'' '''harry-wood''': Areas described in the Comms Guidelines: https://docs.google.com/document/d/19b4QViH5fIau0VBtZhi7AYO1mdftLh34iLIEb5jypu4/edit<br>
''22:09'' '''hbogner''': this time, or maby one hour earlyer maybe wouls be fine for me next week<br>
''22:09'' '''Zverik''': I'll be busy an hour earlier, so it's either the same time or a different day for me :)<br>
''22:11'' '''harry-wood''': This time of day is usually good for me. Don't have many "going out" evening plans lately :-)<br>
''22:11'' '''Zverik''': :)<br>
''22:11'' '''hbogner''': ok, i'll try to fit in next week<br>
''22:12'' '''Zverik''': okay, thanks everyone for coming. I hope we would make a change in coming weeks or months.<br>
''22:12'' '''hbogner''': bye from me<br>
''22:12'' '''wille''': bye!<br>
''22:12'' : ''hbogner left the room (quit: Quit: Pozdrav).''<br>
''22:12'' : ''wille left the room (quit: Quit: Page closed).''<br>
''22:12'' '''Zverik''': good night or day, whatever your time zone is :)<br>
''22:12'' '''harry-wood''': see ya!<br>
''22:13'' '''harry-wood''': oh. want me to post the chat transcript?<br>
''22:13'' '''Zverik''': harry-wood: I'll do it myself, I have the access :)<br>
''22:13'' '''harry-wood''': http://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Working_Group_Minutes#Communication_Working_Group<br>
''22:14'' '''harry-wood''': but do you have the power of http://harrywood.dev.openstreetmap.org/adiumirc2mediawiki.php<br>
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